RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality:(Series III, Entry No.1)

By on May 28, 2009 in Spirit

                                                                                          

                                                                                    Page  1.

                                                         RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality:  Series III        

  •              SERIES III :  GENERAL   INTRODUCTION
  •              RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality:(Series III, Entry No.1)

 SERIES III :  GENERAL   INTRODUCTION

                                                               Purpose and Approach of the Series Defined

 
 RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality:
 
 
I am starting here by , a ‘ NEW SERIES’ of entries on My Blog entitled, ‘RE-xamining "Religion/Spirituality and Sex’ : A cross cultural perspective(with secial reference to Indian philosophy and culture) on this much confusing and controversial topic/word-‘SEX’, especially An relation to religion and spirituality with spiritual or Divine Intentions for cross cultural understanding and for  new insight about all this,ie.SEX in relation to GOD/Divine ,Religion ,Sexuality and Sprituality in amusing,interesting ,Educating ,informative, most scientific,compassionate,spiritual manner  and in reverence to LIFE,NATURE,COSMOS & GOD-’The DIVINE’/DIVINITY! Especially for the benifit  Young generations (globally) in their own language and  and terminology.As SEX is most important when you are young,yong at heart,or Life Affarmative,"YES" to cosmos Type Person, without personal or communal or extra religious bises or biase against RELIGION and LIFE as such,because of distotorted or perveted or confused views about SEX & RELIGION/Spirituality.
I assure You  that  peoples’ views will not be the same after reading ,what ever is going to appear and unfold under the This entry through my pen with  Inspiration and ‘Blessings’  of the ‘DEVINE!’,without any intention to offend any body or any particular religion or for that matter any religion or Faith or belef. in any way intentionally or intentionally in particular and in general.
 
HOWEVER THIS effort is particularly intended to clear the  wide spread confusion/mess/FALSE spreaded  by’ Non-believers’ , so called intellectuals and peveted or vested interests(Political and Commercial Ideologies and intentions) intentinally or unintentionally or because of their IGNORANCE OF THE POWER  and DIMENSIONS OF RELIGIN and Sprituality/Divinity,Called by MANY  With Love and reverence- ’GOD’or LORD.Because he is the Only Who is really LORD OF this world.
This to say ’non belivers’ (in divine) them look yourself in MIRROR!.And Ask Why dont’ you FOLLOW the WAYS OFTHE WISE , Just & COMPASSIONATES/Worshipers of LIFE/Divine!.And Please stop spreading lies about Divine and Spritual People and therir lives.Just continue with the lies spread about your so called demi GODS &godesses ,which you creat and desroy through Your Glossy Magazines and Movies(Illusion of Light and shade/colours and drama).But dont come in the way of rightious!
ARISE & AWAKE! & Follow the wise( Real-KNOWER/Knower of the REAL/Divine)!
_____________
 May Divine show me the way as WE March forward!,Discussing commenting , questioning, ,answering  about this Word/topic/subject,  with ‘divine/spiritual intention’ to bring ‘new insight’ into subject of SEX and SPIRITUALITY,for the benifit of New Genration Globally!
Jut Wait……few minutes!
                                                                             YOU ARE  "WELCOME!"
 
WELCOME! for  Commenting and Questioning,about MY Today’s ‘INTENT’-"My Intent is to Re-examin’ Religion/Spirituality and Sex in a cross cultural perspective( sp. ref. to Indian Philos& Culture!"(27th May,’09),
 
And about the the  article/topic/subject/Discussion I am intending to begin NOW & HERE!.
One and All!without any hesitation!/inhibition/prejudice/biase/malice!,Only with love and/for mutual undesrstanding!
 
Let Us begin!"Love all!as they say before starting in Ping pong play.
 
Enjoy Readings on this Blog! "HERE & NOW"
 
With Love & understanding  to one and All! "Jai HO!" & Amen!
 
@runR
 
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                                                                                        Page  2.

 
 
 
                                                      RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality: Entry No.1
 
Religion, Sex  Marriage,Sex education and Society: In Ancient India
(A re-examination for cross cultural Understanding)
 
There seems to be a wrong notion about india in genral, is that the Indian culture and society totally religious/spritual/escapist,otherworldly only, and  assumes ‘Sex’ as a taboo.This is not right at all.As,on the contrary ‘Sex’(Kama) has been supposed to be an intigral part of holistic life, that is deemed to include 4 persuites(Purusharthas),viz: 1.Religion(Dharma),Earning-Wealth(‘Artha’),Sex-Life/desires(‘Kama’) and Salvation/Enlightenment(Moksha/Nirvana).
 
Life is supposed to be incomplete without married life,of which sex is supposed to be most secret and sacred comment between two souls for bringing forth and upbringin of next progeny in public interests and for fullfillmentr of basic purpose of life-the most essential one of leveing ‘inheriters on Earth’.As such sex is given much priority as reflected in participation of wife(better hallf) in all social and religious activities of Life.
This divinization of sex is reflected in the fact of all the major gos having their consorts all the time with them on their leftsde is a tradition,Viz: Lord Shiva with Parvati, Lord Rama With Sita, Lord Krishna with Rukmani, Brahma with sarswati(godess of learnings) and  Vishnu with godess Lakhmi (godess of Wealth)
 
 As also,we see that,besides, Yoga(Yoga sutra) the most popular contribution of Indian thought to the  world ,especially in west is said to be the ‘Kama Sutra’ or Book of Science of Love  written by First, great sexologist of world  Mallan?ga Vatsayan. This book was originally entitled as  ‘Vatsyayana’s Kamasutram’  (‘Vatsyayana’s Aphorisms on Play of Love’), is supposed tobe  written between 2nd Century C.E .in sanskrit the language of the intellectuals and learned people.And can easily we regarded as the frist book on sex education,much ahead of its time.And leaving sex-culture of west miles(Years!) behind in uniqueness of ideas related to sexual physiology and psychology,as evident from its populariy in the west along with ‘Tantra’, also another  contribution from ancient Indian culture, along with yoga
 
 About 4000-5000 B.C. in the’ Indus Valley civilization’ (First phase of  ‘Indian culture’) a  practice called ‘fertility rituals’ was quite prevalent ,which indicates that the philosophy and religions related to sexuality must be quite  developed and prevalent even during these early  times, when ther was no sign of civilizations in other parts of the world except ‘Mesopotamia’,and  for quite some time.
 
Above mentioned Book of Love Science-“Kama Sutram’‘?????????’, in Sanskrit and ‘Kamasutra’(????????,in Hindi.“K?ma” means sensual /sexual pleasure, and “s?tra"means connecting thread or formula.This book is regarded as the First book of sexology and its writer worlds first sexologist and Psychologist. The book is quite elaborate in exploration human desires like seduction and infidelity. It is has been used in India from time immemorial as  a technical guide by the  married couples. It contains details of various sexual poses(Asnas)
 
Beside this, we find that  all  the puranas(mythological books) and sacred books and litrature of ancient India contained elaborte and sacred references to the importance and instances of sex in life,All the religious stories described female angels(Apsarayen) as servants and wives of demi gods like Indra(God of Rain)and Heaven(‘Swarga’).In the dance, drama,poetry,music,architect etc every where women comes in picture witrh prominence. Romantic lives of Priences and kings of mythology and  Indian history makes an interesting readings.Worship of 10 Wisdome-Godesses in regular  hindu religon and popularity of  wroship of godess ‘kali’ in Tantra indicates to the openess and divinization of concepts related to women and sex- life in Indian tradition.
 
 It is not a coincidence that even in modern India womens have been always given highest respect and privlages in this other wise traditional society in general, with lot of freedome and participation in social and adminstrative institutions from the very begings. As reflected in the fact that the second Priminister of this ‘worlds largest Democracy’,Prime minister Mrs Indira gandhi,ruled the country  for longest tenure of about 19 years. Reflecting modern mind of this traditional country with oldest record as a civilization on the earth.
 
Divinity of ‘Sex Play’(‘Kam-krida’) :
 
The Kama Sutra is the oldest and most notable of a group of Indian texts known generically as Kama Shastra (Books of Love making). According to traditional  religious books the first transmission of Kama Shastra ( "Discipline of Kama") is attributed to Nandi the sacred bull of  Lord Shiva, who was moved to sacred utterance by overhearing the lovemaking of the Lord Shiva and his consort  Parvati ,which were later recorded for the benefit of humanity by ‘Rishis‘(learned people of ancient).Thus in a way sexual play is looked as an art,a gifte by Divine-Lord Shiva and his wife,as a guide for balanced sex life.
 
This reflects the typical Indian mentality of taking and making/seeing  any or every activity or thing  as divine gift and for them even sex-play  has divine origins, And practiced as an art or worship,as we find  in ‘Tantra’ and traditional Indian-Sanskrit literature, poetry and dance-dramas.
 
 
The Mallanaga Vatsyayana’s ‘Kama Sutra’ is quite exhaustive treatise on sexology. It contains 1250 verses all together, organised in 36 chapters.These chapters are further organized into 7 parts as follows.A gance on the  contents will reveal an elaborate understanding of human behaviour,physiology psychology beauty and imoportance of sex phenomenon in human affairs andin the  scheme of Nature.
 
1.First Part: Introductory -This Part  indicate to the three aims and priorities of life, a.) the acquisition of knowledge. b) Conduct of the well-bred householder,c.) reflections on intermediaries who assist the lover in his enterprises .This includes 5 chapters.
 
2nd Part: On sexual union
 
Chapters deals with stimulation of desire, types of embraces, caressing and kisses, marking with nails, biting and marking with teeth, on copulation (positions), slapping by hand and corresponding moaning, virile behaviour in women, superior coition and oral sex, preludes and conclusions to the game of love. It describes 64 types of sexual acts . 
 
Artistic depiction of a sex position. Although’ Kama Sutra’ did not originally have illustrative images, part 2 of the work describes different sex positions.
 
3 rd Part: is  About the acquisition of a wife and includes Chapters on forms of marriage, relaxing the girl, obtaining the girl, managing alone, union by marriage (5 chapters).
 
4. thPart: is About a wife. It includes Chapters on conduct of the only wife and conduct of the chief wife and other wives .It contains only 2 chapters.
5th Part: is about others’ wives. It contains Chapters on behaviour of woman and man, how to get acquainted, examination of sentiments, the task of go-between, the king’s pleasures, and behaviour in the women’s Sleeping Place(‘harams’-‘Shynagars’). It contains 6 chapters.
 
6th Part: is about courtesans Its Chapters deals with advice of the assistants on the choice of lovers, looking for a steady lover, ways of making money, renewing friendship with a former lover, occasional profits, profits and losses. It contains 6 chapters).
 
7th Part: Deals with  the means of attracting others to one’s self and Chapters on improving physical attractions, arousing a weakened sexual power .In all 2 chapters only.
 
It is evident from the above that the knowledge of sex as intigral part of holistic-holy,healthy balanced  life, reaching its culmination in the institution of  marriage & Family, was supposed to be essential and sacred by the  ancient society and is still playing its constructive role in the modern Indian society in tradion of marriage and composit Indian Famlies.And is said to be the reason for  general  happiness of  an average common Indian, inspite of being a developing country.and also for  divorces being exceptions generally, inspite of influences from Technology and modern cultural waves from west. Institutions of Marraige and Family are still popular in India,with general  presence of the joint family system.Religion and traditions are still relevent in’ Indian way of Life’.One important reason  for continuation of spirituality and religion in Indian society inspite of mordernization may be found in  this ancient tradition of giving due regard to  women and reveverence to sexual life, in all  religious  and social traditions and activites form ancient to present times."Jai HO"!
______________
 

                                       
                                     Mythological story of  Lord ‘Shiva’ & Kamadeva (Pleasure god)
 
 
 
In Indian mythology and Religion Kamadeva (Kama – carnal pleasure, deva – god), also known  as Kama("The love") and Ananga (the bodyless), is the god of love and a son of Lakshmi(godess of wealth). He is called Kama Ananga ("Kama the bodiless") as well. He is a young, winged man who uses a bow and arrows made of flowers like cupid . He is also called as Manmadha or Manmatha("God of lust or desire") or Madhana or Madana("God of love") or Kandarpa("God of amour"). His wife’s name is Rati. His other incarniation as the son of Lord Krishna and Rukmini is Pradyumna.
 
Like cupid ‘His’ bow is made of sugarcane with honeybees on it and his arrows are decorated with five kinds of fragrant flowers. His companions are a cuckoo, a parrot, humming bees, spring and gentle breeze. All of these are symbols of spring season.
 
Kandarpa’s body was destroyed when he shot his weapon at Lord Shiva in order to disrupt his penance and help Parvati to marry Shiva. Shiva then opened his third eye, the gaze of which was so powerful that Kama’s body was reduced to ashes. For the sake of Kama’s wife Rati (passion), Shiva restored him, but only as a mental image, representing the true emotional and mental state of love rather than physical lust. The Indian festival Holi, festival of color and especially the bonfire on that day is believed by some as the commeration of this event.

 
 
 
                                                                                                                           (to be continued in next entry)

  With Love,

 best wishes! & "JAI HO"!

@run

About arun raghuwanshi

I AM THAT! 1. I am not mind, nor int ellect, nor ego, nor the reflections of inner self (chitta). I am not the five senses. I am beyond that. I am not the ether, nor the earth, nor the fire, nor the wind (the five elements). I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva (The Ultimate Goodness Principle!), Love and pure consciousness 2. Neither can I be termed as energy (prana), nor five types of breath (vayus), nor the seven material essences, nor the five coverings (pancha-kosha). Neither am I the five instruments of elimination, procreation, motion, grasping, or speaking. I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva 3. I have no hatred or dislike, nor affiliation or liking, nor greed, nor delusion, nor pride or haughtiness, nor feelings of envy or jealousy. I have no duty (dharma), nor any money, nor any desire (kama), nor even liberation (moksha). I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva, love and pure consciousness. 4. I have neither merit (virtue), nor demerit (vice). I do not commit sins or good deeds, nor have happiness or sorrow, pain or pleasure. I do not need mantras, holy places, scriptures (Vedas), rituals or sacrifices (yagnas). I am none of the triad of the observer or one who experiences, the process of observing or experiencing, or any object being observed or experienced. I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva, love and pure consciousness. 5. I do not have fear of death, as I do not have death. I have no separation from my true self, no doubt about my existence, nor have I discrimination on the basis of birth. I have no father or mother, nor did I have a birth. I am not the relative, nor the friend, nor the guru, nor the disciple. I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva, love and pure consciousness. 6. I am all pervasive. I am without any attributes, and without any form. I have neither attachment to the world, nor to liberation (mukti). I have no wishes for anything because I am everything, everywhere, every time, always in equilibrium. I am indeed, That eternal knowing and bliss, Shiva, love and pure consciousness. I am Sada-Shiva,Sada-Shiva! I am That! ***** Visit : Arun Raghuwanshi @ www.yogaway-international.com
View all posts by arun raghuwanshi →

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16 Responses to RE-EXAMINING Sex & Spirituality:(Series III, Entry No.1)

  1. KAN May 28, 2009 at 8:06 am #

    Hi Arun,

    Since you have a grasp on the spiritual culture, do you know who was the first Enlightened Guru in the world? Someone somewhere had to be the first and lay the ground work, but it was probably lost in time or maybe it was passed down through the disciples and we do have the earliest known name. No need to dig into history just wondering if you knew off the top of your head. I like reading your posts and the history of spirituality.

  2. gregory57 May 28, 2009 at 7:40 pm #

    Dear Arun:

    I too greatly appreciate your posts – your clarity and knowledge of spirituality always leave me wanting to learn more. It is good to see the "sacred" aspect of sexual relations enunciated. In western religions, there is a great deal of fear in this area, St. Augustine is primarily responsible for Christians in particular having a tendency to suspect the body and to remove "Divine" participation in human sexual love. Healthy spirituality must heal this rift and bring body, mind and spirit together. Thank you Arun for once again promoting healthy spiritual understanding.

    Respectfully with love,

    Greg

  3. arun raghuwanshi May 28, 2009 at 11:46 pm #

    Dear Greg

    Grate many Thanks! for apprciations of my Blog! and saying so lovely words about me.Hope God graces me to be worthy of all this!

    I am happy that you are liking my posts and presentations.

    I am glad you apprciated, the divine aspect of sex in Indian tradition and religion.

    Thanks for enlightening me about the Christian hestitation about sex and tendency of suspecting body ,and segregating divine from sex(his own creation for perpituation of the inheriters of the earth),a contradition in itself.

    You have rightly pointed out to the need for healing this rift,which I think is due only to mis-representation/misinterpritation of facts and communication gape.There is an urgent need of bringing together body,mind spirit concepts together in the light of new understanding of consciousness principles for the benifit of new generation,in simple more contemporary manner and making them interested in Spiritual/relgious aspects of life for helathy and wholesome life full of jest for understanding Divinity/Lord and his message to human kind in new language and with fresh approach to our scriptrures of every religion for comprehensive understnding.

    And ,this has been mission/effort of my Blog-"development of Love of Diveine through 'A Global cross cultural understanding'!", for the welfare of humanity and communities in present global village communities!

    Thanks once again!

    With Love and regard

    Your brother/Friend

    @run

  4. shweta May 28, 2009 at 11:51 pm #

    Arun Uncle, I dont think Shiva is considered as Aadi Guru.In reality there i sno consensus about it and everyone calls his own deity the most primal being…eg Vaishnavites consider Lord Vishnu is initiator and then there are followers of Jagdamba …who call her as mother of all and primal source.

    @Kurt: If you exclude the controversies of Lord Vishnu /Shiva….amongst human beings Saptarishi (supposedly seven stars of sky now) were enlightened.That is what I have read somewhere.

  5. arun raghuwanshi May 29, 2009 at 12:01 am #

    Dear Kurt

    Loving Namste!

    Welcome on my blog,again!

    Thanks, for appreciating My blog and me, with loving positive remarks about my graps of spiritual culture.

    As ,you wanted to know about -"who was the first Enlightend Guru in the world", I would like to state as follows:

    In Indian tradition Lord Shiva(the Parmatman/Brahman/Consciousness itself) is said to be the Adi-Guru-

  6. KAN May 29, 2009 at 9:01 am #

    Thank you, Arun and Shweta,

    I am truly interested, and I

  7. KAN May 29, 2009 at 9:23 am #

    I see the Lao Tsu and Taoism was 2,600 years ago.

  8. KAN May 29, 2009 at 9:30 am #

    Whoops! I thought it was BC.

  9. arun raghuwanshi May 29, 2009 at 6:03 pm #

    Dear Sheweta Beti

    Love!& Blessings(Be Happy Always!)

    Glad that my effort is attracting young generation like you towards Divinity and concepts related to God! a healthy sign indeed. Actually purpose of my blog is also this,that to increase cross cultural understanding of Religion,Divine principle/God and related concepts and ideas, along with contemprorary global problems having a trajactory in all this.

    So welcome on my blog again after a long gap!.

    'Shiva' is a figure which has appered in Indian culture and scriptures from 'Indus valley Civilization'(More than approximately 5ooo years B.C),through Vedic Culture,to the Middle ages to present day Indian religion and culture-First as (Pasupati,as in archeological seals of Indus Valley civilization),then as 'Rudra' and 'Shankra' in Vedic Litrature(approximately, 3000,B.C. to-1500,B.C.),then in Middle ages' Mythological Litrature/scriptures,to present day tradition of worship of Shiva in "12 Jyotirlinda" in various big holy cities ('Thirthas') acoss the breadth and length of India. At some places the "Kumbha Melas"(largest gathering of people in Fairs)are heald every 12 years in each of these cities in rotation,in which worshipers of shiva gather from world over in large numbers, along with the International Media people & coverages.

    As you have not given any reference to your understanding of the concept of "Guru in Indian culture and tradition". And nor you have provided any reference related to "Sapta-Rishi being first elightend guru."?

    Sweta Your Saying "I have read somewhere", is indicating that you have not studied any classical authentic litrature related to these concepts and traditions of Indian culture,philosophy and religion,or sprituality.

    If you will go in detail and serious study of Indian culture,Religion and sprituality your confusions realted to "Shiva being the first 'Guru'",will be removed. And you will be able to know the real facts and 'TRUTH' ,about all this.

    Just giving confusing statements ,without any reference is indication of neither serious understanding,nor have been part of Classical /scientific method of Indian Tradition of Open discussions('Kandan-mansan/vad-vivada') on any and all questions related to God, religion ansd spirituality.I dont think you are too young to understand these facts ,which I am bringing to your notice.

    Hope you will found more about all this in my forth coming entries and comments on 'My Blog', so be in touch.So that by and by your doubts are removed .The information and materials are so vast and varied related to these types of questions and inquiries.there is no a ready made answer to such questions,which involve serious questioning and answering,with sincierity and commitment, to 'TRUTH' and reverence to the 'divinity principle'.

    Hope! by and by your doubts and confusions will be removed on 'My blog' about this. And you will be able to get your answer and be satisfied, in due course of time!

    Indian Sprituality is not an 'Instant Coffee' of Star-buk! As it requires serious effort to get the drops of the 'nectar(Amrit) of wisdome', which tickles down with lot of effort,on the path of enlightenment, leading to revelation of truth in ones' own consciousness(Shiva)!

    However, if I may say in the language of Bolywood Style-"Muganbo Khush huaa!"(mungambo is happy),seening such wide intrest about 'My Blog entries', even in a 'intelligent bacchi', like You.That is what this 'INTENT' is for!.You are welcome again!

    With love and blessings!

    And best wishes!

    @run

    (uncle! in your language-I liked It!)

  10. arun raghuwanshi May 30, 2009 at 3:28 am #

    Dear Brother Greg

    Loving Namaste!

    Thanks,for liking my entry and commenting so insightfully.

    Thanks,also for reminding me of St.Augustine's role and enlightening me about this important fact about christianity.I often wondered how the otherwise so open societies of christians,especially west can harbour taboos about sex in human life,especially when it comes to religion?

    Greg your remarks are always enlightning,and suggestions most constructive.I appreciate

    you,the 'divine Man',My dear Brother!Jai Ho!to You !

    With love and best wishes!

    @run

  11. KAN May 30, 2009 at 7:32 am #

    Dear Arun,

    Thanks for the explanation. I agree, India undoubtedly had the first and true religion of the Soul and God, and really only the Chinese caught on unfortunately, and the west is still lagging.

    If Shiva was the first name for God, then really he was the first Guru, and then came Brahma or the universe of life, however somewhere someone had to be the first to Realize Eternity and lay down a the ground work for others. After checking I found the seven authors of the Rigveda: Aniruddha, Sana, Sanatsujata, Sanaka, Sanandana, Sanatkumara, and Sanatana. Am I right in assuming that these guys are the ones that started a systematic practice or guidelines to the truth of spirituality, or am I wrong?

  12. shweta May 30, 2009 at 5:30 pm #

    Kurt ,

    sanak , sanatan etc were also created by vishnu for writing vedas but saptrishies were created before that by Brahma along with prajapaties to help create and educate world.All vedas are not that strong a source of knowledge of spiritualism rather few of saptarishies like Vashishtha etc actually taught these yogas to people …it didnt come written in vedas.

  13. shweta May 30, 2009 at 5:32 pm #

    Dear Arun Uncle, as far I am concerned I have read only Ramayana, Mahabharata, Vishnu Puran, Shiva Puran, Then extracts of vedas not the original verses,Brihtta shastra, Jatak Parijaatak,Laghu Jaatak…..well , Krishnas' Dwaraka dates back to some 4000 BC so Rams' brth itself dates back to 5000-10000 BC so Shiva is supposedly having no such close dates of his birth or shud i say he is has no origin of birth….doesnt Shiva purana which is written just few centuries ago says that.Would you like to tell the source you have talked about to say that Shiva was original guru.

    Every hindu mythology says first people created by Brahma were saptarishi and if u remember Manu smriti …Manu actually took saptarishies too on his boat .Saptarishi came into origin even before vedas, and they were born out of Brahmas' wishes …they were human beings but not born out of some human form.

    After Manu (born from Brhamas' will),human beings were born out of human only ; and before Manu only demi-gods knew all secrets of enlightenment and all dimensions of all Lokas.Even krishna says in Geeta that the divine mysetries were imparted by him to Sun and then to Manu…but Saptrishi were first human forms while Sun was a demi-god .

    If u remember the names of Vashishtha who was guru of Rama, yes,he lived over yugas.They were first human beings and gurus along with all prajapaties and Manu.And only they were born with knowledge of divine mysetries right in the beginning. I wish I had time to discuss all this in detail.Wont be able to write more now.

    check this link:

    http://www.indicstudies.us/Astronomy/The%20SaptaR… http://www.scribd.com/doc/9381268/Saptarishi

  14. arun raghuwanshi May 31, 2009 at 4:03 pm #

    Dear kurt

    Please read my this reply to you along with my reply to sweta(as above) for clearity of understanding of what I am intending to say!

    Actually, the concept of "SHIVA as First GURU"is not anthropocentric in Indian religious and spiritual tradition.Shiva as a peron is called 'Mahadeva' and 'Shankar'! with imposition of human qualities on same consciousness(which started all this enlightenment and whatever !)is contineously expressing on earth,like the primordial DNA is still perpituating in our gens.

    Indian sprituality is so beautiful and intelleigently constructed structure and institution that it leavs no doubt on any question and there is no confusion about Shiva and Vishu and shakti.All are one and same!at the level of Brahnaman(Consciousness1).So,Jai Ho to Indian spritualit Tradition,whhich is quite ancient.And Indians were having a surit(listening) and Smriti(memorizing) way of keeping records! and they even not bothered to keep such records of B.C or C.E.as (you reffered in Chinese examples),as they were dealing with Eternity and Divinity concepts and facts.as far as Buddhism and chineese spirituality is concerened they and tibittians bororwed every thing from Indian spritual "Big brother",and translated,improvised and modified accoring to their conveninece.However in west still people dont understand and not want to understand (whatevr) all this!

    Hope every thing is clear!or will be crysatl clear as be proceed in our comments/discussion on this Entry.

    with best wishes!

    @run

  15. arun raghuwanshi May 31, 2009 at 10:49 pm #

    Dear Kurt

    Glad you could follw clearly what is the nature of Indian spritual tradition and how there is scope for considering consciousness principle both as pure conciousness('Brahman') or as some antopocentric , semi-historical/mythological figure or forms (Viz.Rudra,Shiva, shankar , Vishnu , Kali, Durga ect.),or 10 incarnations of Vishnu-like Rama,Krishna,etc.Which (according to most scientific interpreator of Hindu religion,most revered and most popular Indian monk Swami Vivekananda) are mythological/semi-historical figures or profiles/ Characters, elaborated and elevated to the status of 'god' for the purpose of understanding of the common masses through simplification of the higher philosophical and spritual principles and proposition for propogation of religion through Puranas(Shiva Purana,Vishnu purana,…18 satndard and more) and Poetic and litrarory works like Ramayana,Maha Bharata,etc…(Historicity of the characters described in these books have always been a subject of debate,beccause of various reasons).

    The foundation of Hindu/Indian spirituality are Vedas and Upanishadas.Then there is litrature of 'Yoga and Tantra' (and list is endless). As such the 'paranoma of Indian' spirituality is vast and intricate and needs deeper study,understanding and above all real authentic spiritual enlightenment to some extent.Other wise there remains confusion in the mind of the even very wide read learned or so called intellectuals or Knower(Gyatas) of Hinduism/Indian Religion and culture.

    However,as you have named the authors of 'Rigvedas' like Anirudha,Sana,Sanaka etc may be easily regarded as earliest enlightend persons,as Rig Vedas are the 'Oldest of the Vedas',the Foundation Books of Hinduism/Indian Religion.

    Here it should be kept in mind that when we are trying to understand all these concepts at the level of consciousness principle (the Brahaman) and enlightenment etc ,we shold be very clear that whether we are talking of 'Poetic-philosophical litrature of prehistory,Vedas ,or with Upanishdaic intellectual/ philosophical discussions and derivations, or Myhological Books or popular mass poetic and litrary works.

    some answer require a certain level of instellectual as well as spiritual experience,even for uderstanding at intellectual level as in dealing with Higher concepts in Indian spiritality reaquire I.Q.or understanding of the level of Patanjali,or Einstein or ,atleast Deepak chopra level (to give a parameter/measure) for understanding thse things.

    Otherwise most of the people spend their whole life in just questioning,dicussing and creating confusion only. And as you said adding to the mess and confusion already

    prevelant in these matters.!But all this is in a way necessary coponent of progress and better understanding of the facts a part of openess of Indain religion and spiritual tradition, since antiquity.And reason for the populariy and standing of Indian relgion even this age of materialsim and mechanicalities,and information waves through Inetrnet and other electronic media.A sign of strength of Indain philosophy,religion and culture even in this Global age!Amen !And Jai Ho!

    With best wishes!

    @run

  16. arun raghuwanshi June 1, 2009 at 3:42 pm #

    Dear Sweta beti

    Loving blessings!

    Hope, You will find answers to all your questions and confusions/doubts in my above detail response to Mr.Kurt. And will maintain your intrest in learnings of Indian sprituality,religion and culture on the lines , I have out lined in the reply to kurt.

    Reading of only Puranas(Mythological Books),and some relegious books, leaves many important aspects of Indian Paranoma of Sprituality,un-touched. A comprehensive picture can help in understanding certain aspects/answers in peoper perspactive.

    Information on websites is helpful for the purpose of quick refrenece but can not take place of serious and detailed study of the scriptures-like vedas,upnshadas,and litrature from varied traditions of Indain religions in original and quiet thoroughly.

    Otherwise the confusion and doubt will pesisist ispite of all effort to inquire!or some body to answer you?,bcause even understanding them requires some deepr understanding and faith in the divinity itself without any fiaxed anthopomtric immages in mind!So try to go a little deeper than only some thing of sustance in the area of mysticism can come to your graspe!

    Hope you will contine the effort in spiritual uderstanding.

    Love &With best wishes!

    Uncle @run